John Brandenburg Hard Truths - Engineering Plasma Orbs, Fusion, & Mars Nukes

Video Transcript

welcome everybody to another episode of hard truths podcast I'm your host Ashen Forbes and today I have a very special guest Dr John brandenberg he's a plasma physicist he's been well known in the UFO communities for his opinions and his uh as his physics and and science around the potential nuking of Mars today we're going to talk about gem unification Theory we're going to talk about quantum mechanics plasma aliens Mars everything John brandenberg thank you very much for joining me today oh it's a great pleasure and honor to be on your show uh Ashton be talking to you yeah and let's just start right away I want to dig into the secret science government stuff tell us a little bit about your background in terms of your connections to the government any defense contractors or any contract work that you've been doing uh in your life oh uh yes well uh I kind of became part of the defense research establishment uh back in when I was getting my gra uh PhD I did it at Lawrence Livermore National Lab at a q clearance uh then I went from there to another L lore lab is a lab doing uh energy experiments and then also they designed hydrogen bombs on the other end of the lab um and I worked at both ends um uh then uh I went to Sandia National Labs and another nuclear weapons lab and worked on directed energy weapons there um uh I didn't uh work directly on nuclear weapons uh but I picked up a lot of knowledge uh they were kind of always trying to recruit me and get me interested in it and so they told me a lot of stuff and which I had a clearance for um what years mind me asking okay uh oh I started there in 1975 and I finished my PhD in 1981 then I went to San die National Labs and worked there uh till about 1985 and so you knew we had directed energy weapons back in the 80s oh absolutely absolutely it was it was a big program at Livermore and at San die do you think they could shoot them off of satellites or what do you think the where do you think these were connected to these directed energy weapons uh the uh the directed energy weapons we worked were Electron Beam weapons um and we were focused on on uh shooting down basically just missiles it was very it was very tactical uh it was the idea of protecting ships you know like aircraft carriers from cruise missiles and uh uh Electron Beam hits a lot harder than a laser uh you hit something with a laser most of the energy just bounces off and reflects uh but the uh Electron Beam would go right through it and uh um so we uh hey and I I thought I did a really good job I I saved the project at at San die but politics uh was such that uh I violated procedures when I saved the project by contradicting one of my uh management and so uh my reward was uh basically they said uh we don't want you to work here anymore I want you to go someplace else and so I did I went to Mission research Corporation in Washington DC which was then part of the Reagan arms buildup the Star Wars so then I went to Washington DC and I had a top secret clearance then uh and uh worked with the Pentagon and the Intel agencies U on U basically space plasma uh type applications I worked on Fusion Energy also and you're hitting a lot of topics I want to talk about first of all I need to understand this concept of Q clearance I've heard this mentioned all the time CLE related to energy or what is clearance Q clearance I've never heard of that q q clearance is specifically it's a department of energy clearance uh related to knowledge of how nuclear weapons work and uh what their effects are um and you know it's like it's it you know the Q clearance is just kind of an entry level uh it's it's equivalent to the military top secret clearance which I when I left uh Sandia labs they simply just transferred my clearance from being a q clearance to being a top secret clearance with the Pentagon so I could work on uh on direct energy weapons and space uh defense um uh so you have ndas you can't talk about certain stuff still to this day I mean that was 50 years um not really uh do they run out or how does that work well the subjects that I worked on are now kind of unclassified yeah there are a few things I'm not supposed to talk about and okay but those are not those are not big deals uh uh especially in in the context of Mars and U uh the whole UFO UAP thing I was never ready into those programs um I I basically just most of the stuff I did heard about the UFO UAP thing was around the coffee machine and the cooler in these classified facilities where I worked um what people were saying basically just like work colleagues and stuff like that talking absolutely absolutely they would because of my Mars work everyone was aware that I'd been involved in uh working on a dead civilization on Mars so people felt free to discuss things that they had uh knew that they knew or heard heard about UFO phenomenon and uh it was a frequent topic of conversation especially just before 911 when I was uh yeah I was working in uh with the agencies of the Pentagon u in um a classified you know work setting where everything we did was was classified so you were a contractor when you were working with the Pentagon and came back in the 90s then and had secret clearance or top secret clearance uh yes I was a I was a uh contractor working for Mission research Corporation then I was a private consultant then I also worked um for a company called the Aerospace Corporation it's the Air Force Think Tank and they would basically you were considered just a staff scientist they would basically send you to sites to work on various problems and really that's how that works hold on that's useful I don't think people know that so Aerospace Corporation is a think tank for the Air Force they would hire on scientists and then just send them to go do Project work oh yeah and you'd have a security clearance and then they would send you to various uh agencies around town in Wasing Washington DC to work on various projects and U uh so uh you would uh there was no there wasn't any working remotely it was all uh office work inside classified facilities but my job my badge said Aerospace corporation which was a very uh you know it was a very nondescript kind of uh name that the Air Force had adopted so would attract any ention they love their nondescript names like how Communication System these people these Spooks they know how to do it it was all Ashton it was all pretty spooky and uh you know uh I heard a whole bunch of stuff about uh you know people were talking quite frankly about UFO kind of phenomenon when I was working in these classified facilities and so finally after 911 um yeah I left uh simply because the money all went for boots and bullets uh in Afghanistan and uh so um I I took a job down in Florida at the Kennedy Space Center working uh for the Florida space Institute and I as I at my farewell luncheon with a bunch of people from the agency I said you know I'd always wanted to write some science fiction uh uh and I heard a lot of interesting things around the water cooler and you know coffee machine in the hall before and after meetings and I was going to kind of put that all in the science fiction novel what do you think of that and they and to my surprise they very positive they said John we loved your reports if you write a novel a science fiction novel with all this stuff that you heard in there we'll read it and makes just that's fine with us as long as it's labeled science fiction so I made it a science fiction soap opera you know and it it's Morning Star pass the collapse of the UFO cover up I'd just gone through 911 and one of my bosses commented uh and were're there in DC going through 9911 and one of my bosses commented two weeks after it had happened he said if this could happen anything could happen and uh so in my uh in my two women of course glamorous news anchors bring down the UFO cover up at finally at Great risks of their lives and there's an attempted Cita by the secret government which says the UFO cover up is too big to fail so there's actually a tank tank battles in the streets of Washington DC at Capitol Hill and uh and kind book my kind of story I like it oh oh absolutely absolutely travel in it what was there any time travel in it uh no there you know was there was a flashback or two but uh no I'm uh I'm not a big fan of of time travel as a physicist um you know like the second law of Thermodynamics basically and the expansion of the universe those are kind of things that determine the uh the arrow of time and um you can't make all the galaxies come back closer together and uh by that token then you can't go back in time and uh we all wish we could go back in time and do things a little bit differently than we did you know but uh have you ever seen uh these experiments they do where they are looking at waves and big pools of water and they drop like a rock or a big heavy object in there and they then look at the wave and kind of like model out the wave well this is the reason why I think that you might be mistaken now I've had the same that you just mentioned on on Time Travel but it looks like there is quote unquote a Time reversed wave that you can see basically the reflection of all waves that occur and if that's true then yes you're right everything's getting more and more complicated spreading apart but then couldn't you with a smart enough computer or brain you know reverse things back to the state that they were or you know model out where they would have been in the past and figure it out oh oh precisely Ashton your your intuitive um your intuitive understanding is correct microscopically physics is time reversible it's only when you look at the big picture A bunch of molecules interacting instead of just like two of them two of them you can reverse time but if you have a bunch of them the second law of Thermodynamics takes over the same way with the Universe um an individual Galaxy you think well it's just sitting there spinning um you could you know go back in time but all of the galaxies are spreading apart and that that gives you a definite time sense but the only times I've ever been really wrong about anything ashon is when I said something is impossible so I considered unlike I considered unlikely but not impossible that they could do time travel um it's a great topic for science fiction I wrote a science fiction short story about that and uh uh and the guy went back in time and he was trying to witness the birth of Jesus and everything everything went wrong he was arrested by a spy by the Romans and fogged almost died because he he missed the time uh to be there so every everything everything went wrong and he and he ended up being stranded back in the past and uh yeah there's a lot of paradoxes especially with going to the Past you know and that's why I think that I agree with you that maybe if there is a way to manipulate time it's not going to be the science fiction I'm going back to 1957 to you know kill my grandfather and then stop existing it would to me it would be more of like life extension technology like the ability to reverse a tumor or something like that in like a localized absolutely yeah and and I'll I'll mention one thing to there there's a very important piece of physics done by wheeler and Fineman you know dick feeman who got the Nobel Prize for 1965 uh developed the black hole Theory and also he helped he he engineered the hydrogen bomb he was in charge of actually I know which bolt which kind of bolts to use etc etc and it worked and but they came up with a theory and they found out that the future can talk to the Past yeah it's so there's there's if you ask somebody like like me okay can you go back into past and uh kill your grandfather or something like that I would probably say I think that's very unlikely but can you talk to your grandfather in the past yes apparently that is that is allowed by physics and this is something Ash you got to realize the physics Community is almost like a big country club where certain things are not discussed scandalous things like uh the affair of the uh uh head of the country club with his secretary you know these things are just not discussed at meetings or at the uh and so there that's wheeler Fineman Theory basically says the prophetic knowledge agrees with physics um like for instance one of the reasons I decided to write science fiction is because I realized science fiction was prophetic so many times yeah that you had to like somebody wrote this uh novel called futility it didn't sell well with that title but was about a great big steamship full of rich people traveling across the Atlantic at high speed for the first time runs into an iceberg and sinks with massive loss of life and it was named the Titan in his novel and if you look at the measurements the description of the ship it matches the Titanic almost exactly it was written 12 years before the Titanic disaster yeah there's a lot of predictive programming and like you know even Ben rich said that everything that you can imagine in Star Trek is already been figured out oh it has I I I I believe Roddenberry was on the he was in the loop they told there saw too of uh X Files where X Files was talking about Zero Point Energy and capabilities as well which I have a feeling is end up being proven true it does make you wonder how much of this stuff to your point about the books and the movies and the content we consume is people that are in the know and they're writing the stuff under the this idea of it being fiction when in reality I'm an exam I'm an example of you know in fact I I joke I said I am the clueless tool of the US government you know and that I they they basically encouraged me to write all stuff about UFOs in as science fiction and uh I ran into some people from the uh agencies I worked with and they had read the novel and they said John how did you know all that stuff you know and I said why just I just guessed a lot of it and they said well you're a really lucky guesser and uh so it's a u there's a lot of stuff in Hollywood movie science fiction movies that I believe was directly provided by the agencies to Hollywood um get us comfortable with the idea of this technology and other life existing or something more nefarious oh well uh oh well the ever since World War II and and before that the British film board basically would use movies as a propaganda tool to prepare like they they they've made point theage they're trying s you know I think well they have they've been trying to bring the public up to speed believe it or not their intent their overarching intention is that certain things will become kind of common knowledge but not certain other things uh you know they um like I found out that uh for instance Roswell was actually the Roswell incident was a shoot down it wasn't two saucers crashed in the middle of the night they didn't crash they were shot down apparently so I wrote a book about that what by radar or something else oh they were shot down by uh they got bit by a black widow uh which was the Air Force's night fighter at the time was a World War II night fighter was a twin it was twin p an engine fighter it but it had radar in the nose it had was very heavily armed with 420 mimet cannons and then a turret on top with 450 caliber machine guns in it and the it was only uh you the uh World War II had only ended less than two years before so you had all these veteran Crews um for these night Fighters and they were stay in the southwest and according to Philip Coro the When the UFO govern when the uh UFOs started having this you know the Flying Saucer Original Flying Saucer surge uh the air force uh you know it wasn't the Air Force in those Army Air Corp concentrated all of its security around Roswell do you know what was stored at Roswell no all the nuclear weapons on Earth were stored at Roswell along with the bombers to carry them yeah and so the government was protect this was the first incident of the UFOs zooming in on our nuclear weapons stock pile and the US Government after Pearl Harbor the Battle of Bulge World War II the death camps it was it was not going toh tolerate any anything that looked like like a threat so they they had uh at night uh these night Fighters and apparently they they uh ambushed two UFOs two saucers over Roswell trying to spy on our nuclear weapons and shot him down one of them crashed near Roswell you know let me I'm gonna play Devil's advoc because I'm skeptical and I grow more and more skeptical of the connection between UFOs and nuclear nuclear weapons as time goes on and I'll explain why I've actually was all in on this idea before and uh Robert uh Salah you know he's I think one of the nuclear technicians that says he watches stuff get disabled by the UFOs wouldn't nukes just be like little child's toys compared to a species that has a craft that can uh where's my phone just float like this freely because according to mainstream physics there's no fuel source that could fit with this UFO to make this be able to fly off to other solar systems it would there just no amount of mass could fit within what we see on the in the UFO and it would just make it heavier it would just make it harder so that means they must have an energy source that's far beyond nuclear atomic bombs so why the hell sorry for my Parton my French why would the aliens give a crap about some primitive Apes figuring out how nukes work oh there's a lot of things Ashton about the whole whole UFO experience that don't make a lot of sense Until you realize that part of this is a display it's it's a scop operation oh here here's now you got me on board I absolutely believe that there are alien species out there that were not alone in the universe we found that out on bars you know I mean the universe is huge so you know you don't have to convince me of that there's probably aliens out there somewhere if we can teleport then aliens can get to us really easily as well and they could also be there's there's What's called the Einstein Rosen Bridge yeah equals yeah and so yeah we you can find question is why would they care about nukes then if they've got this super advanced technology why do they care about nukes just give me like the top one or two reasons oh uh oh because nukes use the same power source that powers supernovas and uh okay they know that if their ship gets hit with a tactical nuke it will be destroyed and it doesn't matter how many or just from the destructive power oh just from the destructive power uh ashon you got to remember uh a lot of uh this is uh you know here's a uh you know great white Hunter arriving in New Guinea and uh he's standing there in his khakis uh with his rifle and he says I have a magic bangstick and uh the natives then pepper him with arrows because he doesn't have any body armor and he's dead thunk thunk thunk so much for white man's magic and and but you want to create the preach that you're bulletproof and you'll notice in a lot of science fiction movies one of the first things that happened is somebody will shoot an alien and the alien will fall over dead it's great scene Earth versus the flying saucers once they got outside their air their force field they could be shot just like anything else and uh uh and and this agrees with reports from uh even abductees that sometimes uh abductees have actually realized they're coming and sit there with a gun and the aliens see that and decide not to not to hang around and but you want to keep up the pretense that oh none of your weapons can hurt me fact there's a great there's a scene in a science fiction movie where a woman is holding a gun on this guy who's an alien and she he says can't hurt me and she pulls the trigger and he falls over dead yeah everybody that's the thing I like is that you know it's they're not Invincible a UFO is not Invincible alien body isn't be Invincible we all we all have to succumb to the physics of this universe we live in but so let me go down to another question so you said number one sorry yes yes I no it's fine but I this I want to dig into these topics which is okay work the same way want go the energy source the energy source is potentially the same way as as a nle work let me just ask you this what what is the energy source for a UFO what in your opinion what what do you think the energy source in my opinion uh some of it is a lot of it is beamed from mother ships so you have okay um and and and by the way if you if you're Defying Gravity you're making uh the mass the effective mass of the UFO becomes zero and interestingly enough so once you get over a threshold you need very little energy to keep it hovering or flying uh that's why they can you know do these sharp right turns as they're they're basically being treated as if they have no inertia and um inertia by the way is the handshake that objects make with the rest of the mass of the universe to you know show that they have a mass and so in my opinion uh a lot of the smaller ships are just beamed U they just have a a nice tight microwave Beam on them to give them just enough power to run everything but they don't need much power when they're when they're in this weightless State um if you if you're kind of in a state of local zero gravity then you don't need any energy to preserve that you all you need to do is make sure that that fields that do that are controlled uh the larger ships I believe run on Fusion Energy just like the stars and once we figure out how to make uh Fusion Energy you know we're we're doing that now uh I've worked on that almost all my career on and off to work on Fusion Energy it's incredibly you you can make Fusion Energy that technically releases no radiation uh so you could actually sit beside the thermonuclear reactor on your ship and it would generate megawatts of power and enough to power just about anything you want so oh well people talk about Z Point Energy and you think okay uh like pressure like uh you know a can of uh air at very high pressure you can get energy from that you you open the valve and blow the air through a turbine that gives you pre but that's a pressure difference if you're a fish down in the bottom of an AR on his trench you're surrounded by pressure but you can't feel it because the pressure inside your body is the same as the pressure outside equilibrium so0 energy people it does have very high energy I mean quantum mechanics predicts that the Universe has all of this energy in it every U every cubic uh centimeter but here's an example of how to release Zer Point Energy make yourself a small black hole and stuff into it the black hole will swallow most of what you feed into it the rest of it will vaporize and turn into a plasma and if you put up what's called an mhg generator to get the energy out of the plasma flow out then you can generate power from this black hole by just feeding it aspirins every and so but the thing is is that if you lose control of that process then the black swallows everything entire planet so I'm just saying unless you know what you're doing on this I well that's that's a way to do it according to sakarov Andre sakarov oh he's one of my FV Russian physicist that's what he thinks okay well then now I definitely think that's the answer so it that's just as simple as I mean and when you think of stuff it can just be energy CU eal mc² it's a masses energy so if we're just shooting like atosc laser pulses continuously onto a point then theoretically we can produce a tiny black hole and sustain it by just keep zapping it more and more and more and more as long as we have like perfect Precision on our on our and we basically created a a particle collider then at that point right I mean that's what that is just laser so now there was a paper that I read on this front that said that it tried to argue I think it was a little too optimistic that the Hawking radiation or black body radiation would prevent the black hole from ever stabilizing that it would radiate away before that occurred any hot takes or opinions on that if you start let me let me say real quick too before I before you answer is that Salvatore pise adamantly disagreed in private conversations with me and said that for sure we can produce a black hole so what do you think well Salvador Palace and I have uh we even published a joint article where he he made a great discovery mathematically uh from general relativity called the Super Force and um we you know I helped him get that uh published in you know just a scientific journal and so we get we get along just f I um yes you could make a tiny black hole like with an Ado laser beam and and and then but according to Hawking Hawkings theory if you make this tiny black hole it disappears almost instantly and you just basically get the energy you're basically just taking perfectly good laser energy and turning it into black body radiation coming out there's no it's not clear that you can uh get any gain from that I I tend to view Zero Point Energy as something that if it was easy to do um it would be like a black hole that could then uh get out of control and swallow everything you were trying to power specifically like your entire planet so it I I'm not a big believer in Zero Point Energy that will be able to harness but like I said the the few times I've been wrong in my physics careers when I said something is impossible so uh May let's explore that a little bit more so do you think free energy is possible is real or are you more of the there's no way to get more energy out than in I I pretty much I don't think I don't think there's cos the cosmos provides you with a free lunch except for the entire Cosmos itself I was gonna say except for the entire the time that happened where everything except for the entire lunch that's my favorite counter is when people say there's no such thing as energy from from nothing and I go except for that time when the Big Bang happened and all energy appeared from nowhere except that see that time was allow never but you know you're you're a podcaster that's great uh you know but you could talk about these things and you're right you're right uh you know uh the Big Bang was an all you can eat buffet for lunch uh and uh so it's but uh Fusion Energy especially burning like uh dyum and helium 3 that has the potential to be you wouldn't be able to tell the difference between that and a free energy machine if it it was just a black box and and you you put in a tiny amount of helium and a tiny amount of heavy hydrogen you get all this energy out uh I mean it would be easy in fact it would be easy for an alien to claim behold my Black Box human it produces free energy from the vacuum and and then you say well what what do you feeding into there oh helium it helps it helps it helps the reaction go you know it work by the way you got to realize you can't if the universe is full of snake oil salesman and not all of them are from Earth you've got to realize this is a cosmopolitical almost Cold War situation we have going with some of these species especially the short gray guys and you can't believe anything they tell you nothing okay well before we get to the aliens I got a few more hard physics questions on that front so yes yes plasma so and this is the something I've struggled with which is that are people that are in the hot Fusion Community really saying that we're just getting you know if you do the chemistry we turn two do heavy High hen dyum atoms into a helium and we get a little bit of excess energy um oh well you don't it's it's is that correct uh but but in terms of since E equals MC squ C is so big the the amount of energy released is enormous so the fuel then heavy hydrogen uh is relatively abundant right on planet Earth so that would be like we can get it from anywhere can we get it from the air yep yeah that seems pretty B there's kind of like a lot of air on this planet so you could just have your device have you seen this ng8 company that is literally producing cold fusion plasma that they claim just runs straight off the air just like that uh no I'm by the way myself and were teller a mentor at our school that I went to at Livermore he would come around and talk to us and uh give us lectures and stuff I talked to him several times uh it was a great honor to me to do that and he um basically encouraged us to always think practically about everything um and his reaction to Cold Fusion was well wow there's probably it turns out the volcanoes on the bottom of the ocean in the Mid-Atlantic Ridge put out all of this heavy helium it's called helium 3 or no actually light helium helium 3 instead of helium 4 and helium 3 is the product of Fusion reactions so he said nature is already doing cold fusion there's no explanation for all this helium 3 coming out of these volcanoes under and but at the same time my own experience has been that yes you can apparently get some energy out of cold fusion but very little it's like uh a radium watch dial puts out light okay maybe you could clamp solar cells on a radium watch dial and say oh I'm getting uh infinite energy from radium well it's not very much energy it's not enough energy to run the watch as it turns out you know you have to uh but people have invented now nuclear batteries that run for thousands of years without needing to be recharged but they don't put out much power nature yeah I yeah go ahead yeah nature likes big releases of energy [Music] like uh Mass it invest in a star in order to get like the to make the sun work my my son who's kind of a wiseacre but it's also very smart said Dad if you want to have harness fusion power just put up a solar yeah I I don't believe hotus Nature Nature has well you you may very well be right and somebody in his garage a uh harness figure out a way to harness cold fusion but my own impression after examining that field for many many years is the main problem with Fusion is is that it's cold and okay because it's cold it's not producing it's not giving you much it's more like a radium watch dial than than uh uh than something like a fusion reactor like the sun um why does electricity but I don't electricity you know like that's I look at that problem is that's a benefit like we can do cold fusion that'll produce heat there's no question that we can harness nuclear energy to get uh electric power I mean I used to live in Wisconsin and uh you know we had four nuclear power we had four nuclear power stations powering the uh State during the winterly uh uh I I had a guy who was a I I I was teaching at a college State College and teaching physics in a omy and one guy on staff he was a big advocate for wind power and solar power and in the middle of winter I would drive to into work and I'd see him I'd say Josh there's no wind there's no sun why are the lights on in this building and the answer was nuclear power yeah and so we've already but but you know of course that uh Vision power has its own of problems uh Chernobyl Fukushima Three Mile Island everything has RIS when so I don't find it very efficient though to just boil some water and spin a turbine that doesn't seem like a very intelligent way to produce energy to me and you might be right maybe right now we don't have very powerful Zero Point Energy Taps but oh I I I mean it's just an engineering problem to me I mean you say oh we can produce some energy but we can only produce a little bit of Mount and I say okay well let's try something else and I would say hm maybe plasma for example and this leads me my next question that I want to ask you about which is are you familiar with Ken shoulders are you familiar with Hal POF and do you know about their EV hold on let me finish real quick do you know about their evv condensed charge research that the Pentagon like highly prioritized in the early 90s so because they like they answer all your the questions that you said there about the zeroo energy the plasma everything we've been saying to me is well look at Ken shoulder's Evo work because he's basically saying here's the answers to all the problems that you just described Ken shoulders was just a marvelous guy I had a very pleasant lunch and then at I spent several hours sitting in my office and he was chatting with me in Washington DC and we got along famously he showed me all his experimental work and oh it was just great uh it's so sad that he's not around now now uh uh he in the things that he told me he was not talking about it as a an energy source but you know I'm sure that his thoughts evolved on it he may figured out a way the the phenomenon that he found his EVS uh electron vorum the strong electrons I believe that that he was really on to something uh and the fact that it didn't get pursued means that probably it's part of a classified program some place uh you know uh all of us uh my own experience is is stumbled on how to make gravity modification in the lab I mean it was very tiny amounts part was uh when I would talk about publishing it the people who had paid me to do the work who my later discovered work for the the agencies said uh we we think that that would be a bad idea John uh you know we paid you good money to do this research own it and we don't want it out there basically was the what they told me uh you know was and it was it was not even direct it was more like John you'll be on really Shaky Ground if you try to get this stuff published and if you want any more money from us you won't do that and so so basically I discovered that the government could do gravity modification based on this gem theory that I had worked on um and what that meant though was that there was a enormous classified program going on on about this and that uh they basically wanted to see what I could do based on this fairly rudimentary Theory I developed of unifying gravity and enm they wanted to see what I could do with it and um to see if they had to uh you know give me a bus ticket to site 51 um and what they did is they kind of satisi satisfied themselves that I didn't have you know I couldn't make anything fly around the rule I would just make things get lighter on a on a chemical scale and uh and so what they did is they basically just said good work John don't don't talk about this to anybody and maybe it will give you some more money more money was not forthcoming finally I got a $200,000 Grant from DARPA to develop my theory of gravity enm unification which leads to control gravity and uh one of the stipulations when I got the money from uh DARPA was we don't want you doing any experiments this is purely theoretical do you understand and I said yes sir please sign my check so let me talk people um so you're familiar with Ken shoulders work you said but what about how P off yes this is the name that comes up over oh how put off is a scholar and a gentleman uh and he has a very similar Theory to mine yeah ofing gravity and enm that he has published he and I get the same results for how to produce gravity modification and I I just published an article where I basically showed that you can get the same uh you know in know the equation that gives you flight for airplanes you know the wing the basic design of the wing for an airplane it's called the bruli equation you can actually derive what what is and it works in the vacuum it works on the moon because it's uh change in gravity uh with electromagnetism and I showed that I can get that equation for my theory and then if I go to Hal put off's Theory I can get the same equation using his equations so we have slightly different models uh his uh both of our models can be summarized in that if you have two bright objects in a dark box they put out a black body radiation field and they push against each other because of radiation pressure so they'll push each other apart in this dark objects in a dark box push each other apart because of mutual radiation pressure if you put two dark objects in a Bright Box you heat the box so it's white hot they actually attract one another because of mutual shadowing and goes as one over R square just like gravity and that is kind of a way to summarize the theory of both myself and Hal POF Hal pof's original work was based on Andre sakarov uh you must understand that a hydrogen bomb runs on radiation pressure you set off an atomic bomb inside a watermelon shaped casing uh at one end of the ca one end of the watermelon is an atomic bomb and you focus all of the energy coming out of that onto the other end where they have a ball of hydrogen Isotopes and that's what gives you a and so Andre sakarov was working on that basic design of hydrogen bomb which is the same as the teller design and um he basically realized oh you could get a theory of gravity out of this so he published a very brief article about how Quantum the quantum zero point energy produces a radiation pressure that pushes objects together and the theory and how P off uh took that theory and expanded on it and U uh but I give uh H Hal and I get along just great uh he's a great guy we basically get the same answers okay Dr brandenberg you know I'm a huge fan of your gem unification Theory I love your analogy of the black box and the light inside the black box or the light box with the black inside of it the reason why I love it is that it shows this duality of gravity where you can have this attractive force or repulsive force and I think that's one of the big things that we get wrong on gravity is that we assume it only has one force effect but potentially it could have an opposite one and I love that your theory also explains you can actually calculate Big G which as you were mentioning before I just had to edit this you were saying that this really impressed a lot of the people that you know this Theory shows that we have big G now are you familiar with some other people that have come up with similar theories like uh fried wart winterberg has this theory of plank ether hypothesis which is also very similar to yours and how PUD off there's another guy Larry Reid who is the I think a former locked uh Martin engineer that he has his big book on Quantum wave mechanics and it also has similar similar theories right were you familiar with any of them I'm I'm not familiar familiar with Reed's uh work but Fredick winterberg and I uh go way back unfortunately he's not with us anymore yeah um yeah he I met him first when I was working at Livermore really he was a friend he was a friend of my the one of my thesis advisors and uh yeah and then I would run into it periodically over the years and uh his reaction to my big G was skepticism oh yeah he says if you're right I will carry your bags to Stockholm you know when you get your Nobel Prize I like the sound of that but uh he he was a he was a very C kind of a grumpy character when I knew him and uh you know and uh uh I I I'll give you one quick story about him he independently figured out how the hydrogen bomb worked and started publishing that and was amazed when the US government showed up and confiscated all his papers and he didn't like that he was very grumpy about that and he he would show up at scientific meetings uh wearing a carrying a big billboard saying the government has confiscated my papers and saying I can't talk talk about this or that and I remember the comment of my thesis advisor to him a very brilliant fellow named Harry seline's not with us anymore but he said freed wart he always called him freed wart he said we already know how to build a hydrogen bomb tell us something tell us how to do you know harness Fusion Energy so you know we could power our cars you know the hydrogen bomb problem that's already been solved and and uh but so winterberg was a was a very independent uh rugged individualist U he apparently worked for as a graduate student for Warner Heisenberg who was in charge of the uh the Nazi Heisenberg uncertainty principal kind of like a big deal oh yeah the uncertainty principle and uh that was his mentor that was winberg's mentor and it turns out he's been working on all this secret stuff and was plasma researcher like you as well and turns out you knew him oh I just showed a picture of his book his book's got an atomic bomb exploding on it on the front of his book it's literally called 1981 the principles physical principles of thermo nuclear explosive devices I mean I can see why the government might like have you know put them under lock and key so they it was it was a very awkward situation finally the government uh decided to just declassify a lot of the stuff that he was talking about I thought they didn't when did that happen because what I had heard that happened about in uh 1980 about the end of 1981 finally so he he kind of won he kind of won that but other people were figuring it out too just from open literature yeah and uh but uh yeah so he yeah but that that was the thing freed we already know how to build a hydrogen bom tell us how to build something useful you know give us the free energy devices um free energy devices yeah what do you think about Eric Davis it's the last guy I want to ask you about Eric right hand man pal off Eric Davis is a brilliant guy uh and um he worked with Hal put off which you know for years which is uh anybody worked with how put off um is is a good guy I I haven't uh I haven't spoken to Eric Davis uh in years we had a few brief conversations and conferences uh what about his papers like specifically he's got one about extracting energy from the vacuum one of the methods is using an electrostatic what do they call inertial electrostatic confinement process he's got a paper about ball lightning which is basically how to stabilize a ball of plasma and then he's also got a paper on wormholes traversable wormholes uh Stargates and dark energy now go these are all very very interesting good things uh I myself was tasked by the Air Force to make ball lightning only we were forbidden to call it ball lightning we were given three quers of a million dollars in a three-year program to make ball lightning uh we managed to make it in microwave ovens and uh and it would just run for minutes you could just make this ball of fire uh appear and uh sit there for minutes in the microwave oven uh we finally made it as big as soccer balls in a u in an industrial mic how did you make it bigger well we went to a regular a regular microwave oven uses short wavelength uh uh and so they have industrial microwaves that uses a lower frequency so the wavelengths are bigger so you can cook larger things uh like a ton of bacon you can cook a ton of bacon at once using industrial microwaves so we went up to the facility uh where they had a big industrial microwave setup and made ball lightning there we made it as big as soccer balls what wait what did you call did you call it ball lightning or did you call it something else we we called it P leading persistent ionization in air you'll notice if you watch a lightning strike someplace you'll have a lightning strike and then there'll be like half a second will go by and then a lightning strike will follow exactly the same path because the air is ionized air has been ionized and it stays ionized and by the way that that violates all present theories of how the atmosphere works so there's something mysterious we when we first produced our ball lightning we went to a conference sponsored by the Air Force and the people ahead of us were from some University they had several professors and their teams of graduate students and they said that what we were attempting to do was impossible and then we rolled in a microwave oven and did it right in front of them and you know what they didn't come up to me and shake my hand afterwards no they sat in the back of the room and looked very grumpy like what I'd done was a cheap some cheap Carnival trick but we made go yeah we made this ball lightning as big as soccer balls that we got welder sunburn from it so if you see ball lightning in your backyard stay away from it it's probably charged to a million volts do you think you could turn it into a drone that could be remote controlled well let me put it this way if you are generating anti-gravity Drive according to the theory that myself and how put off has a very similar Theory then you're generating powerful electromagnetic fields around an object and that will turn the air into a plasma State like cell Elmo fire so you from a distance it'll just look like a plasma orb you would't even be able to see what's causing it I guess my question is is there something can you put something inside of it that can do that or does it have to be projected out to it like the mic you could you could put something inside of it uh something that's nullifying local gravity uses such powerful electromagnetic fields it actually breaks down the air uh to make it Glow and it make makes it weak Plasma in the air and in fact if you don't if you're not careful if you make the plasma to and tense the whole effect will just shut off and your thing will crash yeah that's why you need to stabilize it right you have to stabilize it um so it's a uh um and uh by the way uh according to my theory you can tell UFOs are coming from miles and miles away before you can even see them because they put out electromagnetic signature and um my own belief is the government already knows how to pick they can tell a they can tell a regular hobbyist uh you know uh it's absurd to think that people are Ming Balloons with with UFOs using electromagnetic and like you know endothermic drives is what I'm going to call it they're not the reason why we're filming an infrared and thermal and stuff like that is partially because it's just better sensors but also because they're able to pick this stuff up like instantaneously compared to Optical Spectrum right yeah um let me ask also if you have the right uh if you are looking for the right frequencies of electromagnetism uh and this has been known in the UFO Community for a long time uh they they say that one frequency that the UFOs like to use is 30 it's half of wall current instead of 60 Herz is 30 htz and there reasons for that that I won't go into uh um maybe but it's a well I mean it's it's it's you don't want to turn your UFO into a radio station uh because uh the shorter the wavelength the more uh the more radio frequency you Emit and uh finally uh all your power just goes into making uh enm radiation radio waves and you don't want that you want the radio you want the electromagnetic field to hang around your ship so you can fly so my own belief is the government can pick up um the U they can tell the difference between Joe butt's uh hobby uh uh drone that he's just flying around uh just because uh he likes to do that and and a real uh UFO uh by the way I will uh I I don't know if you want this opinion right now but the whole draw this whole so-called drone thing at its core I believe is a UFO surge of a surge of ET UFO sightings the government is then desperately running around with its own drones and its own helicopters with light bright lights on them at night all you can see just is a bright light and so the government is trying to blow as much smoke as possible and they've always done this whenever there's big surge of UFO sightings they call it swamp gas they call it sightings of Venus they call it weather balloons uh when the UFOs were flying over Washington DC and jet fighters were chasing them they said these are just temperature inversions you know uh you know in the air and so the drones are a very convenient thing where the government to um yeah use as a lame a lame excuse I mean if these were real drones they wouldn't be able to shut down right Patterson Air Force Base and Langley Air Force Base yeah they're um they're using as neural linguistic programming you know it's just a diversion call a UFO a drone this is why I was asking you the earlier question about do you think these balls of plasma can be drones and what I would recommend humbly you're the expert is check out Ken shoulders scientific paper called primitivity transitions because at a essentially argues that after he realized that space was not empty there really is this ether of energy the Zero Point Energy yes he realized that if you make this ball of plasma that it actually has anti-gravity properties just naturally because what's happening is the Plasma's changing the permitivity of that region of space changing the speed of light and so it turned out that you could just if you think of like biological extension you could use this plasma on say a Hypersonic spy plane to allow it to cut through the air quicker you could use it on a UFO so you could have a craft inside you know and your Plasma's covering your UFO or why have anybody in there at all why have it be a transportation device at all just turn it into a drone just put a small device just a drone and now youve got a drone that looks like a ball of plasma like a star that it can just float around and and and how POF he has like one major patent that's been approved five different times it's just called communication system like and this is one of the spookiest names ever because you read it and it's like oh it's a Quantum communication system that doesn't use electric and magnetic fields it just uses potentials scaler potentials I'm just looking at it and I'm going he's got a he's got a gravity communication device that can control a plasma drone because it says right in there it goes through plasma I'm like oh well there's your communication method anyway thoughts on that oh oh uh well the the scaler uh the scaler waves phenomenon was first talked about by Tesla who who if anybody would know about such stuff it would be Tesla so uh unfortunately he didn't leave a lot of well in the notes that we know about and of course when he died the FBI it was in the middle of World War II the FBI went to his apartment confiscated everything in fact it was Trump's Uncle president Trump's Uncle yeah John Trump the let led the uh uh you know the the team of FBI agents they just took everything but the bare walls I think they even took the wallpaper that he might have scribbled on but anyway he believed in SCA the scaler uh potential uh electromagnetic fields of you know are vectors they have you know but like a pressure this is like a sound wave a sound wave is what's called a scalar wave it's a pressure it doesn't have any direction to it it just has a number and Tesla talked about this is it turns out the gem Theory I work on and also which was used by U Einstein is based on clu the Coline Theory five-dimensional Theory and when you do the five-dimensional theory to unify it unifies the mathematics of gravity and electromagnetism so it does that and what also falls out is this scalar field that so let me jump in here because Tom Bearden also references all the same physicists Kua Klein sakarov everybody you've been talking about and he explain uh scaler physics a lot of people don't understand it and so I think this demonstration will help because this is actually something Tom mon talk he's also a physicist and engineer if you haven't talked to him you should he talks about this and it's a very simple thought is that right now if you were to take two waves like electromagnetic waves with the right hand rule blah blah blah yeah and you have them out of phase of one another like this or it can be a triangle formation any zero point system so they cancel each other out so whatever their amplitudes of their waves are cancel each other out conventional physics would say okay that means I'm pulling on both sides of this rubber band equally okay so it's not gonna move left or right right now I can pull twice as hard same thing it's not moving left or right I can pull five times as hard eventually this rubber band is gonna snap right that stress in the medium is the scaler potential that's the gravity that's the effect that we feel from all the energy around us all the time what do you think I like I like your analogy I uh with your permission I will be using it go ahead I'm paying it forward you know I'm paying the analogy forward because it's important it's a simple way to think about it where you would never say that there's nothing here like you would say that the more I'm pulling this you're creating this stress and you can hear it by you know interacting with it to me that's what SpaceTime is and all the energy on top of SpaceTime is is that there's different stresses and this is what I think Einstein showed in general relativity different amounts of stresses in different regions and this ball of Earth that we're sitting on causes a very large stress that we feel is gravity all around us right yes so you know what let's let's let's talk some smack about some people you know if you want to sound off on the academic you know maybe I'll sound off first and then you can sound off let me let me sound off on the Academia tell you you sound off on the Academia Community first and then I'll respond and then all sound off on the UFO community and you can respond I you know I went to a string Theory it was primarily String Theory conference because that's where uh theoretical physics has been concentrating I fortunately brought my uh my nice girlfriend she wanted to go to the conference with me and uh i' I've been married twice uh and divorced twice so she anyway so she's standing there beside me this guy looks like he wants to slug me after I showed him my my G the the derivation for Big G because they can't do it and it's and he accused me of a mathematical slight of hand that I'd hidden G in one side of the equation made it appear in the other side and I said here's the derivation here's my equation it's three lines where's Big G on this other side of the equation that I make up magically appear and and it was just like a fight in my old high school where I grew up if you want to know where there's a fight just look for a crowd of people around it and a bunch of people had crowded around to watch this and you know he just was just furious with me what do you think makes you so mad what do you think that what do you think that comes from like I know you're not a psychology expert the string theory real real academic science uh at especially in the big leagues is it's you know it's like professional basketball it's not supposed to be a contact sport but it is uh in a tight game championship game with a tight score under the net the final minutes the knees and the elbows start to fly I mean uh it gets really personal uh do you think that money has to do with it or is it more it's a fight over it's a fight over money uh and um prestige power I mean how can I get to be a department head if I can't find Big G and this guy brandonburg has done it you know and his number is part good within a part per 10,000 you know um and this other graveyard came up to my uh paper and I I had the equations all up on a big screen and he says he's looking at everything very carefully and I said sir I can help you walk I can walk you through this Theory you know in my derivation for Big G and I also get the mass of the proton you know which is mass of hydrogen and he just looks at me he just glares at me and says no I can read it for myself so these people uh won't give me zip credit because it will IND they view um science as a zero sum game if somebody else's the Theory uh other you know if somebody else's Theory gets any kind of credit or publication in a nice Journal then this this diminishes me how can I become head of the Department of physics at Harvard if this idiot brandenberg is running around talking about Big G and so they go ahead yeah so the government has determined the the way that science will go in this country by funding string theory for like 30 years they're they're gaslighting the entire academic community in my opinion String Theory obviously doesn't work it doesn't produce anything that can be tested in like at CERN and the and and basically the government says well if it doesn't have strings in it we're not going to fund it and what they're doing is they've they've taken people like me and Hal put off and uh some other people have taken the two long range forces of nature electromagnetism and gravity and unified them mathematically which is B you know started by cloa Klein Theory yeah and they don't want us working on that in fact even Einstein who worked on the unified field Theory said he says I've gotten the impression the government is not happy with my work on unified field Theory and wishes I would not talk about it anymore and it's because there's been a classified anti-gravity program what you're really talking about is a theory of anti-gravity yeah for Gravity modification and so why can't Academia figure it out I mean so I guess you get it is like is it really just as simple as the money is coming from the government to fund it and they only fund the research that they want they only fund the research they want you would still think though that and I agree with you by the way that absolutely they don't want anyone looking at unified theories they don't want anybody looking down any path that will lead them to the physics which is the ether is real there is an a field of energy that's out there there's an extra Dimension like CLA Klein said um and because the moment you figure any of this out everything unravels you realize like oh we can easily do Fusion oh we can produce we have these energy sources they're exotic energy sources we can produce anti-gravity we might be messing around with time as well so you know you can see why they would do it but the part I don't how are more physicists not figuring it out from my perspective I'm a guy with no PhD I've been researching this for the last year year and a half and I realized there's I I mean I feel like not only is there something here not only is this UFO phenomenon real but the physics it's not even like there's all these options it's like the what you know what you said with gem Theory how PUD off Theory they're all sakarov they're all based on this idea of this energy field all around us yes the same concept and I that's the answer there it is these guys have all been saying it you know brandenberg here how off like these guys might have seen UFOs and secret projects for all we know I'm not saying you did but you know I think definitely has um and so it's like why are other people not figuring this out what do you think the reason is why is it just like this guy Ashton and my crew of Misfits well I'm I'm part of a re band up in the hills basically uh along with Hal put off and some other PE workers who figured you know figured out the riddle uh in my opinion it's as simple as okay brandonburg you have this Theory with this uh bruli vacuum bruli equation what does an aircraft what does a craft look like that uses it well yeah it's a saucer with three bumps on the bottom and and and once you see that picture you just say oh this can't be right and we're not going to fund this and um in fact even the word the term anti-gravity marks you in the academic Community is somebody who can't get funding from the government you call it gravity modification and uh and but you but all of that is apparently just completely been subsumed by this String Theory business and they've wasted $30 billion and and you could say this is what's called the winterberg effect winterberg stumbled on how to build the hydrogen bomb just from the open literature he was close enough that the government decided to confiscate all his papers scolded him it didn't do any good uh finally they just ended up declassifying basically his all its ideas and U uh so but this is the winterberg effect applied to uh gravity enm gravity uh modification uh so like suppression and it's depression stigma adding stigma to certain topics like you see this a lot and this is why I use certain topics like UFOs cold fusion anti-gravity although I actually use gravity modification just because I think it's more accurate but yeah it is it is they stigmatize these topics and then nobody will touch them Academia won't touch them now I want to take it a step further because I want to talk about aliens in the UFO Community is that I and I'm gonna I'm gonna be a little adversarial here actually but first I want to say that when I started researching the UFO side of this I was disgusted by the community I did not expect what I found is I found this community that's hyper political that like admonishes conspiracy theorists while also claiming that there's this major conspiracy by the government to cover up aliens and I also found that people are very obsessed with the idea of aliens in general that everybody's got their belief system about what the aliens are where they come from or what have you perfectly honest cards on the table I don't care about any of that I don't care where they come from or what they are they actually don't surprise me if they exist because like you said I think the universe is a big place there's aliens out there I have no doubt and whether or not they're visiting us unless they're impacting my life I don't I don't really care but what I found with the UFO commit was much like what you reference with Academia is they treat it like a zero sum game like if I'm coming in I'm taking away attention one of the things I heard a lot was that I'm hurting the UFO Community when I come in I'm researching a literal missing I'm going how am I hurting the UFO Community it's not like this community has a huge amount of credibility here talking about the blue telepathic aliens that nobody's ever videoed like I'm talking about a real missing plane and technology so here's the thing that I really want to ask you about is that my opinion after a year and a half is that a lot of these disclosure Advocates like the Lou Al zandos of the world that are out there and anyone that's in his crew you'll see them always doing stuff together like Jeremy Corb the George naps they are essentially in my opinion on the government payroll and they're saying that here we'll give you aliens aliens in this hand are real and that's not that mind-blowing to anybody in my opinion no you're not really revealing anything about it and then they say well I'm hiding something behind my back for National Security they say I always protect National Security and I go well what what is it that you're hiding back there behind your back because you're saying that aliens are real and I think what they're hiding back there is basically the first hour of this podcast which is they we've figured out cold fusion we've figured out free energy or at least a source of energy that's so unlimited that we would consider it to be free energy and that that's a national security issue because hydrogen bombs you know Zero Point Energy bombs whatever the next we're going to call the next Evolution that's a national security issue and so my opinion the whole UFO thing is that you've got people out there that are grifting off of it trying to sell people this hope for the aliens are going to come save us and you know fix all the problems in the world you've got these other people that are just lying by a mission that are like yeah aliens are real but can't I'm not going to say anything more beyond that and then you got a few people like the step Greers of the world and uh people like dark journalists who say like we've got this crazy technology out there maybe it came from Aliens or it did come from Aliens but that the the all about the military protecting it so do you think that my assessment is fair and which where do you align on this CH I I I I tend to agree with just about everything you have said I mean we probably differ on a few details but um I mean I I met Lou alzando I I thought he he's typical of some of the people I worked with in Washington DC were veteran uh peoples from the agencies uh they'd been down in Latin America uh you know fighting uh communist gorillas and stuff these were tough guys he he struck me as just one of these really tough guys who's come out of the Jungle given a suit that you know you take off those camos Lou we're gonna give you a business suit and you're gonna go to some conferences for us and uh you know I immediately liked him because of that and uh but it he's he's basically admitted that he's still on the government payroll and he basically sort of saidwell I can't talk about that because I haven't been authorized to and I thought well I thought you were I thought you were a whistleblower whistleblow thought you a whistle blower no it turns out they he's been given a whistle that doesn't blow it blows only one note you know and uh and no disrespect to him because I agree like I respect our veterans and yes I do anyone if anyone wants to make the choice they're going to protect National Security over disclosure that's fine that's your choice I'm not I just think that if you're going to try to be the spokesperson for this at the same time do you think it's true that the thing they're hiding behind the back is the science and the physics and the technology do you think that's what they're hiding or you think it's something else I oh there's that component but then there's a lot of other stuff uh like black projects black dark operations or what you what do you think well if you read uh you know if you read the novel or you can actually watch a video synopsis of it on YouTube it's just called Morning Star Pass edition three it's like half hour there's even a short one but there's shorter version but it you'll realize the government has been fighting here here's my understanding we are involved in a low intensity conflict with some of the species out there especially the little short gray guys and the government at one point entered into a secret treaty with them and that's forbidden in the Constitution con treaties are supposed to be ratified by the Senate they're supposed to be negotiated by ambassadors that the Senate designates and with the advice and consent of the uh Senate and apparently we no we actually uh uh decided to Short Circuit that entire process and come up with a kind of under the table agreement with the Grays um and if you found out the government allowed the Grays to kidnap a bunch of people harvest their sperm and eggs so they could make hybrids uh and in return for giving us technology during the Cold War uh you'd say gosh when did the Senate ratify such a treaty and and gosh there's an actual treaty somewhere there's a paper trail for this you think or oh yeah well there was uh that all ended apparently uh remember the Cold War uh remember Papa you're too young to remember Papa do devalier who ran Haiti for this guy wrapped himself in Voodoo as a way to terrorize his own population Not only was he a ruthless dictator but uh but he um he mesmerized his people by the idea that he was a personification of the god of death in Voodoo and uh so therefore he could uh make people disappear or torture them to death uh whatever he wanted and um and he he was our faithful AI in in Haiti though because he was a staunch anti-communist during the cold during the Cold War and so the government has been involved in a lot of stuff the UFO coverup has gone on for 80 years and the US government has not exactly followed constitutional Norms uh you know in their defense you know what they would say they would say well desperate times require Desperate Measures you know we were facing the Communists on Earth we were facing the Grays from outer space uh why why are you so convinced that it's graze from outer space because I've looked at the list of non-human intelligence options and there's like 50 and only like one of them I I I agree completely the univ un is just like the Earth the universe is a very complicated Place uh we appear to be in a strategic location in space um I can give you more details on that but basically we appear to be in a strategic location and were the focus of attention for that reason for a number of extr interstellar Powers um there's only three basic groups there's uh you there's three basic groups and that's a gross oversimplification but you know there's the little short gray guys they're terrible is is my understanding that all the animal mutilations and abductions and stuff 90% of them 90% of all of that is done by them and human mutilations too are those the ones that are like the AI ones with no souls that people talking about or is that different well they they act like a bunch of soldier ants uh organic AI yeah it's organic they used to call it in Marvel Comics Androids Flesh and Blood that's the little gray ones do they have names or they we just call them little gray guys they just call them little they call them the Grays and apparently they have copper based instead of uh yeah iron based blood they have copper based blood so it's blue leading to the idea of Blue Bloods being you know kind of Godlike and uh but the octopus uses blue blood and so you can support a very Advanced nervous system with blue blood however copper based blood is not as efficient as um Iron based blood as it turns out that's why all the major land animals on Earth in a high oxygen environment uh use red blood things like scorpions and tarantulas and stuff they use blue blood and so the uh Gray's uh attempt to kind of occupy this planet with hybrids failed apparently because they couldn't get hybrids that were viable based on a mixture of blue and red blood and one of the places where this idea of blue blood comes in or green blood comes in is in the Star Trek by the way Spock was supposedly had copper based blood do they need can't they just go some other planet that's good for Blue Blood aliens and also where do they come from oh this is a real nice this is a this is a nice Planet you know you uh I have a cartoon shows a gray standing there in space by the Earth and he says it's a nice Planet you have there and you think they just really like this planet like it's like some kind of got a lot of water lot of water a lot of resources it's a nice nice big planet and not only that it doesn't have dinosaurs running around um eating anything that they see uh it's a very biofriendly planet for somebody like them especially because they're short and U so we have that group then we have another group straight out of Star Trek the equivalent of the Vulcans they are our cousins apparently and I had conversations in Washington DC with people who I knew were absolutely experienced Professionals in the Intel business who told me there are people down on Earth you could walk by them on the street you would never notice them and they're not from this planet they are basic and you can't tell them genetically from human beings in fact we're part them and they call them some people call them nordics other I call them just the plans and U you notice in Star Trek and they even commented on this that a lot of the beings they encountered in the U outer space were basically very very humanlike the Vulcans being the primary example uh Spock's mother was human and his her his father was Vulcan they they they got together got married and produced a healthy kid and so yeah so that's that's another group and they're apparently are friends they're helping us that one surprises me but also doesn't at the same time like I would expected aliens would be so different from us but at the same time the one that would freak me out the most is if they look just like us where they were indis and I think that that's believable because I look around at people and I wonder if they're an alien sometimes I I look at them and I go if that person was an alien I would not be able to to tell like you know no you can't you can't there's so much variety to what according to what I was told you can't tell them apart from human beings by blood type or genetics and and uh they said this was of a concern because they thought they were getting security clearances and becoming involved with the government and they wanted um they they actually asked me because of my Mars because I was of my Mars work I was considered kind of an expert on ETS and they said do you have any uh and by by the way the the marivil what's that ET expert John Brandenburg well the the the Martian or the what I call the sidonian civilization up on Mars they look just like us well hold on I want to before we get that they didn't look like lizards but the thing is okay so so there's people like us who are apparently our cousins somebody said oh they look like us and I said no they look like them because because of shorely back in the back in the day yeah and there's all these Greek Legends like that now real quick because I I want to know if there's any other theories because you're competing with some pretty pretty out there ones I like the weird ones uh Jason Jani thinks that humans from the future went back to the past and made Atlantis and that we've got some kind of thing okay okay the other one I've also and and did he did he talk about when they crash in the desert and the coyotes eat their bodies you know I don't know I'm just saying oh this is all kind of some somebody was saying this is these are holographic simulations or these are humans from the future and I said yeah with with copper based blood they're from the future and what okay what about maybe they made those aliens I don't know you said they're organic AI what about AI what if a hive mind has taken over and the hive mind can literally just like 3D print the UFOs straight out of the e oh there I'm sure there's certain amount of that they say that okay the real pros among among the ETS uh 3D print or UFOs here at Earth for using Earth material so the Isotopes all match so if you getra pieces of crashed UFO you'll just say well this aluminum just looks like regular aluminum from an aircraft isotopically you can tell stuff where if stuff is from offworld like meteorites because it has different isotopes than stuff on Earth ask you about that but before we do that I it's the Mars stuff to that we can finish with that um I mean I have a simple answer it's us like we've figured this out like why why are we dismiss that I'm literally talking to you John brandenberg right now you knew winterberg you know all these scientists you're you're looking this stuff why is the answer not just like hey you're just spitting this tale about aliens because you know we've figured this out and you've worked on these secret projects and like you can't talk about it like why why isn't that thing well there's there's very little that I worked on that I can't talk about it yeah but you know people but but and by the way I was never read into the UFO program GRS so I can you know I actually I'm not violating any security I talking about it uh you know like I said they they said go ahead and write about what youever you want in this novel uh as long as it's labeled science fiction John and so they you know they gave me that U uh I I tend to um I know that we can travel to other planets we went to the moon six times I believe that and um we may have gone farther with alien technology who knows the idea somebody else could what we didn't lose the technology to go to the Moon though right you don't think that right like no we may have been told not to go back to the Moon okay but there were also there were geopolitical reasons uh we have a space treaty called the outer Spa we actually have a treaty outer space treaty called the outer space Treaty of 196 7 which was ratified by Congress signed by the Russians signed by the Chinese signed by every European uh country and it's uh it say basically says you can't claim like the moon or Mars as national territory It also says you can't put nuclear weapons in space and uh so it's a u uh well so the question though is like do you really think that that we we don't have I mean the military US military China do you think we've got anti-gravity technology yes I do yes I do yes I do yeah so by the way why can't it be us why does it have to be aliens when we're seeing stuff flying around or do you think that there's a mixture oh oh the the because of the accounts of uh if it was just us I think it would have been Declassified a long time ago but because of the alien aspect that people are generally people in the government uh once the toothpaste is out of the tube you cannot put it back in if if it comes out that the government knows we're being visited by people from outer space who are more advanced than us it kind of quells into question who is the chief rooster in this Ro in this Hen House you know is it the US government or is it somebody from Outer space you know they people start asking you know we thought we were the top of the food chain uh apparently no there's other links in the food chain you know there's there's powers above the powers on Earth and no power on Earth likes to be demoted yeah most of us are at the bottom and we don't care who our ruler is if it's somebody else on another planet now I get you might be saying that you know our government might be ready to battle with the space aliens uh you know that would actually track with what Salvador P has been saying about human technology and oh yeah well the the we apparently are involved in a low-level conflict with the Grays and we've been there for a long time um and we finally it's uh we tried to we tried to make make nice with them uh with a treaty and then we found out they were violating the treaty and then this culminated in this uh proposed CL military clash in a place called dce New Mexico and uh based on what I heard in Washington DC that really did happen I heard several accounts and um the basically the only difference between the accounts was the body count some people said oh 60 humans got killed other people said oh no it's more like a hundred and other people said oh no we only lost five the aliens lost lost uh lost 60 it on and on it went and you basically just kind of take the basic story and um and apparently uh by the way this tracks with Hollywood apparently during the secret treaty uh regime which lasted apparently from 1968 into about 1979 78 close and they Hollywood celebrated this by Close Encounters of the Third Kind which is a Love Fest between ends with a Love Fest between the humans and little gray aliens uh okay then you fast okay that comes out in 1977 then there's the Clash at Dulce where everything goes to Pieces was under Jimmy Carter and what's the next big movie about aliens to come out it's the movie Alien which is a about you know we're back to blood sucking aliens uh utter betrayal by the authorities of the humans and you know and that's that's if you watch Close Encounters of the Third Kind it's from 77 and then alien from 79 you get some idea of what happened well I look at it and I just go you know if these aliens exist they really are shy camera shy at least nobody's finding making any people shoot at them well not taking videos I'm not seeing any of them online but you know if they look like us that solves that problem now let meum to the last topic here which is the the Mars topic because so I'm just going to summarize my understanding of of your uh book about Mars that because there's certain isotopes that are found within the atmosphere I believe this shows that there was very like if not certainly nuclear explosions that happened on Mars could explain why there is no magnetic field maybe but really the question let me finish real quick so real quick the story is that there was a civilization on Mars in the past they potentially destroyed themselves with nuclear weaponry and perhaps they uh came transported came over to Earth and now we are them or something like that is that go ahead and fill in the gaps uh I you're I agree with the basic idea that there was a dead there's a dead civilization on Mars and it dates from a time when Mars had an earthlike climate I'm the discoverer of the Mars ocean by the way one of reasons I uh hold Academia in this country in a little bit of uh disregard is uh you know they won't give me credit for discovering the Mars ocean even though I uh if you if you look on in we Wikipedia Mars ocean Theory I'm reference number one you know I was the first person to propose it but they never give me any credit and uh because of my other work on Mars now it looks though as though there was a primitive humanoid civilization on Mars predating the dinosaurs which shows that the basic human form predates humans on Earth humans are a u a super terrestrial phenomenon but you got to realize we're very practical look how many places on Earth humans live we're a very practical rugged bunch and um but is it it appears uh and by the way I've shown the the evidence I have for the thermonuclear Holocaust on Mars to nuclear experts several of them and they agree with me but they they can't be quoted on the record so are you saying that they wiped themselves out and they're gone or are you saying that out in remnants made it to Earth or do you just not know or not care what's your opin uh oh uh the it based on the evidence that I have I'm trying to analyze this as just a scientific problem um they look like us because human beings are a super terrestrial kind of phenomenon in the Stars just like in Star Trek but these people were fairly primitive they did not have nuclear weapons themselves uh they did not have space travel Bas basically what we find is what looks like a fairly Bronze Age or stone age you we're talking Old Kingdom Egypt or the Mayans or the toex from Mexi Old Mexico uh kind of civilization and then it looks as though someone else came along and dropped two hydrogen bombs as big as the Empire State Building on Mars utterly destroying the civilization there and not only that but destroying the entire biosphere of Mars so it could never recover how are we making the inference that they only had a certain level of technology and that somebody else did that what's the evidence well there's no there's no evidence of any highways um uh the there's things that look like fortifications but they're built on high ground it all looks uh there there's no indication like airports or you're talking about the topology of the planet of Mars itself you're not right it does not look like an advanced civilization which makes it even more sad that apparently somebody who was very Advanced came [Music] along and destroyed them and uh that means that it was somebody who uh it been somebody like the plans who are basically human they would have probably just conquered it but instead this is somebody who uh was very non-human supposedly these reptilian aliens that uh you know there's very hardly any stories about them but apparently they do exist um and but the either the Grays or The Reptilian uh aliens uh somebody who did not like human beings at all decided to make an example out of Mars um genas Khan would make if a city resisted him he would kill everybody in the city and make pyramids of heads uh just as to terrorize everybody so that the next city he approached he'd knock on the gates and say just open your Gates give us all your stuff otherwise you'll end up like the SI last City you know as a pyramid of heads will'll kill everybody and so this a we terrorization wouldn't you just take out the whole planet if you have that kind of advanced level technology why are you dropping nukes like again it just feels like we're taking our level of science understanding we're pretending like like it's the highest level of Technology that's out there if you're a civilization coming by doing a drive by bombing I I feel like you should easily be able just wipe Mars out like Mars isn't there anymore we would never have any Trace Ashton why turn it into a black hole why turn Mars into a black hole when all you need to do is just destroy everything on the surface you know it's like uh guess you know what you're what you're talking about is somebody taking the planet Mars and turning it into a black hole um you know that's that's there's there's a there's like a zero point energy weapon would do something like that and uh no no they didn't bother with that they just uh okay hydrogen bombs are easy to build the Russians basically showed by the way you could build hydrogen bombs as uh big as the aircraft carrier Enterprise and um let me ask you this because this is how I kind of want to this is my final question for you okay which is do you think we are going to annihilate ourselves do you think we're going to get past the fmy Paradox and the great filter uh you think doomed and why do you believe that um well you know we're talking fundamentally about things we can't know we we can't know what's really going to happen future but I'm religious I'm just an Episcopalian you know uh and um you know Bible prophecy basically says the human race is around uh in the future getting in the same kind of trouble it gets in now you know uh and um uh by the way you know AI is in the Bible there's a city called AI in the Book of Joshua you should read about it it's actually spelled Ai and uh so I'm not worried about AI uh destroying us um though I think we we should be very careful about that uh so I think the human race is going to do fine I think the vision for the human future is Star Trek that's the way we're going to be okay I appreciate that I am not as optimistic as you are I think I look around and I see the destructive capability that we are able of unleashing and I think that inevitably it's just a matter of time till somebody presses the wrong button everything's gone just like that but my I prefer to talk to people that are more optimistic than I am I I'm I'm I'm quite optimistic I think with God's help we'll get through this and go ahead and shout out whatever else you want or where people can find you I appreciate you talking to me today Dr brandenberg has been a great conversation Ashton it's been a pleasure and honor to be on your show uh I wrote a book called Cosmic Awakening it's available on amazon.com I also wrote the science fiction novel um in 2003 it's called Morning Star pass the collapse of the UFO cover up and we're going to turn it into a movie ni uh two beautiful women who are news anchors bring down the UFO cover up there you go that sounds like a bestseller already Blockbuster so I hope it does well let me know and I'll I'll check it out promoe it for you uh Dr brandenberg thank you very much guys this was another episode of hard Tru podcast uh make sure you hit the like hit the Subscribe follow do Dr brandonburg and we'll talk again soon